WINE ep 1
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[00:00:32] Mick Wilson: Hello, this is Mick on Wine of the Divine. I'm here with my first guest ever, my bro, Bill Wilson, CEO of Wilson Creek Winery. He's my older brother, known him all my life, and I'm glad to have him here because he would be able to set , the tone of our winery and what makes it work and what makes it thrive.
And before we start, Bill, I need to ask you what, what, uh, what, what are, what are we drinking?
[00:00:57] Bill Wilson: Uh, it's one of the wines that I think we make very well, and the valley in itself makes very well, and that is our award-winning Petite Sirah. That is a big, bold, badass red that, uh, I will stand up to pretty much any wine
[00:01:12] Mick Wilson: Anything but petite. I've got right here, I got going on... I had to bring this up because we're gonna go in a little history here. This is our legacy going back '06. We named this after, uh, my, my parents to honor them, Rosie and Jerry Wilson, who are on the label, and we had to change the name because that was used, but it was pretty cool bottle.
And I got a little cork in here, but tasting pretty good actually. I'm surprised. So
[00:01:40] Bill Wilson: 20 years later? 20 years
[00:01:42] Mick Wilson: 20 years. It, it's, it's a little going down that bell curve, but
[00:01:48] Bill Wilson: Yeah.
[00:01:49] Mick Wilson: Oh
[00:01:49] Bill Wilson: As you would ex- as you would expect a 20 year
[00:01:53] Mick Wilson: So for those that aren't familiar with Wilson Creek, We're going into our 25th anniversary. Get us caught up a little bit on, on the dream of the winery. Like, how did this whole thing begin?
[00:02:04] Bill Wilson: Ah, you know, the whole thing began with failure actually. Um, I failed in the financial arena and, uh, because I just didn't like it. It didn't suit my personality. It was a dog eat dog. It was a, what did you close today? Where's your next client coming from? Um, and I looked left, I went right, I looked up, I went down, I did it all, and I just didn't like any of it.
So after doing a whole mergers and acquisition firm, I raised money and my financial analyst spent it. Uh, I knew I needed to do something different, so I asked my best friend what I should do for a living, and he said, "I know exactly what you're gonna do." There's a winery out in Temecula. It's run by a 75-year-old single guy, no kids, wants out, willing to carry paper, and I said, "Holy heck, for the last two years of my life, I've been looking for a 75-year-old single guy, no kids, wants out, willing to carry paper."
And he's like, "I think your family would be really good at it. I have some restaurant experience. I've got some capital. What do you think?" And I'm like, "Wow, that's kinda crazy." Um, but I knew f- that our family would be really good at it, and it stems from, you know, back in our high school d- age that we kinda ruled the high school, and we, we were the social, um, if anybody knows this, is listening to this from South Pasadena knows we were the social hub of, of South Pasadena.
We threw the best parties around. Nobody could touch us. Our parents would go to jail today 'cause, uh, they allowed minors to have alcohol, but they thought it was in a controlled substance. We were gonna have alcohol anyway. It was just,
[00:04:06] Mick Wilson: they were at every party too, which was
interesting.
[00:04:09] Bill Wilson: I think they had more fun at our parties than we did, and, and, and we took that serious.
We had a pinky promise that says we would not throw parties without them being there, and, um, it was a absolute mutual respect 'cause we did throw a party, and one of, uh, our friends became an absolute idiot and almost killed himself by drinking, chugging
a quarter tequila. I don't, you know, cut that out. I don't care.
But, you know, again, it gets to the relationship of the bond of our family and our cohesiveness of, of being together, and and that's really what it was all about. My, you know, our, our folks were gonna go move up to Solvang area, and that meant, you know, we were gonna lose, uh, a really good friend, dear friend, uh, and our parents, and, uh, yeah, I said, "Hey, instead of doing that, what if we sold the home and put it on a down payment on a SBA loan in, in little Temecula," and da, da, da, da, da.
they said, "You're crazy, but you know what? It's your inheritance." I'm kinda paraphrasing everything. "What does the rest of the family think?" And I said, "Well, let me, let me, let me ask." So I called you and, uh, said, "Okay, if, uh, this flies mustard with Mick, it, it's gonna work 'cause, you know, it's wine, it's alcohol, it's a whole thing."
And your comment back to me after I laid out the whole program was, "Jesus' first miracle." And I'm like, "Yes, I got through the religious." I mean, that was a big step. And then, uh, we both agreed that Libby would be a pushover, and we'll just go contact her, and she actually was the deal killer in saying, "Why Temecula?
Why not Paso? Why not this? Why not that? Why not Napa?" And da, da, da, da, da. And we're like, "Well, we don't wanna be country bumpkins. We're the 14th winery down in Temecula. We've got this great opportunity. We can't afford those other places." So that was why we, we chose Temecula. Uh, my wife did not wanna be a country bumpkin.
Um, Temecula was the icing on the cake. It was, Temecula in and of itself as a city is absolutely spectacular. So the cake was the winery, the icing was the beautiful people of Temecula, and there's been a love relationship, uh, with Wilson Creek and the Temecula Valley for now 26, if not 30 years, and we bought it
[00:06:49] Mick Wilson: So, so when, when we started the winery, uh, I remember some other wineries called us the first winery of the second wave, meaning hospitality. What do you think, what do you think fit with our background in South Pasadena of hospitality and the timing at the winery and Temecula Valley at the time? How do you think it, it clicked?
And maybe also share your initial business plan and what happened to that
[00:07:15] Bill Wilson: Well, there was, there was two things that really made it click and, and to, to realize that hospitality was what's really matters out here. All the other wineries, they, you know, they had their, their little niches that they did and whatnot, but in our, in doing the research, um, there's three components to running or operating a winery.
You gotta grow the grapes, which is biology, full-time job, full-time education. Then you gotta make it into wine once it's, the grapes are matured, which is a full-time biolo- uh, chemistry, not biology. And then once it's in the bottle, now you gotta sell it, which is completely different from any of the two. So the research says, you know, if you do two out of the three, you're gonna screw up one of the two, if not all three.
Stay in your lane, bro. Stay in your lane. And, you know, choose one and then hire the others. And, you know, I, my dream of in, when I was in college of going out and being a farmer in Iowa, of the farms that we owned back then, through the family and taking it over from the corporate side was something I kind of passionately cared about, but it's not where I wanted to live.
Um, so anyway, ma- make a long story short, uh, when it was like, oh, farming, okay, that's good. And then, uh, chemistry, okay. And then hospitality, okay. I think our family, I think we could each be one of those or, you know, collectively do that. But it was really when we were starting to make our wine, you know, at another winery, and a tour guide came up and asked the wine maker if he would please address the tour group. And he's like, "No, no, no, I hate that. I just wanna make wine. I don't wanna do all that stuff, and they want me to do it and I don't wanna do it." And I went, "Aha, I'm gonna do something that no other winery does. I'm gonna- we're gonna be the most hospitable winery in the valley, if not in the world, and we are going to be there for our guests.
You know, they're, they're gonna see a Wilson. Um, I can have somebody else do all the stuff behind the scenes. We wanna be in front of the scenes." So we threw out Rosie and Jerry in front and center. They were, they were the bartenders, and then on the weekends we all bartended. And during the week we did all the work, and they continued to be the bartenders.
So, um, that was really the, the impetus of what we were gonna be. We were gonna be the hospitality company. And, uh, today, 26 years later, I'm proud to say we are known for our hospitality, and beatings will con- beatings will continue until hospitality improves. I will beat them, you know? Smile, wham, you know?
So it's something we preach, something we live and, and there's a Wilson here almost every day, all day, um, in various shapes or forms, especially now that the, uh, next generation of Wilsons are coming up, and Christopher and, you know, Rosie and Jerry. Jerry, unfortunately, is not with us, but Rosie still is, and she still comes down here and gets treated like a, a queen at 95 and three quarters,
[00:10:43] Mick Wilson: The matriarch, yep
[00:10:44] Bill Wilson: Man, that's why we did it. We did it to be together as a family. And you know, good news, you, you work with your family. Bad news, you work with your family, you know? You still gotta show up at, uh, Thanksgiving and Christmas
[00:10:56] Mick Wilson: Right? What would you say that in those initial years, I, I mean, there were some challenges, of course. I go up to Napa and some of these other areas, love these wineries, but you hear the stories of someone who's retired with millions. They don't know what to do with it, so they just dump it in and do a winery and for a hobby.
Ours was a little different, but what would you tell people who weren't there in the initial years what that was like? And i- pretty intense
[00:11:23] Bill Wilson: Yeah, it, it, um, it wasn't easy. And if it, if it was easy, everybody'd do it. And we were a one percenter on the opposite end of the spectrum of one percenters of owning wineries that had no money. We had zero money. We took, um, the home equity, put it in a down payment, and we sold everything we had. Um, we got screwed by the IRS.
We got hit double time with the IRS 'cause the, it didn't get open in time. And, um, so we had the bucket of money that we thought we had, which was limited to begin with, got stripped away, so we really had nothing. We had to borrow from family and friends, and when you borrow from family and friends,
[00:12:14] Mick Wilson: That was hard. Mm-hmm
[00:12:16] Bill Wilson: a whole, it's a whole nother level.
And, um, that was really actually a motivator. Um, you know, the failure was not an option. Uh, we succeeded because we all knew this was Operation Bootstraps. Um, we had peanut butter sandwiches for lunch, and for dinner we had the luxury of putting jelly on them
[00:12:39] Mick Wilson: And, that's not a joke. That's
[00:12:41] Bill Wilson: No, it's not. People laugh and go, "Ha ha." No, no, we, we, we didn't have much.
I mean, we had nothing. And Rosie can make something from nothing, and she was a magician. And if you invited me over to your house, I ate you out of house and home. I ate like crazy. So, and we'd all eat before we go to McDonald's, and, uh, because we wouldn't deprive our kids of a Happy Meal that they split, but we got to work in the j- you know, we got to let them play in the jungle gym that was air-conditioned because we didn't even have air-conditioning out here
[00:13:17] Mick Wilson: And, and I, I remember on that, at that day we were maxing our credit cards 'cause we had to buy equipment for when we opened, had to get the barrels and the tanks, and everyone was just maxed out. And wasn't there a morning where, uh, your, your car was impounded?
[00:13:32] Bill Wilson: Yeah. Um, that was, that was a thrill. I look up and, and there goes my Suburban from my house driving down our road, and I'm like, "Who, who's in the Suburban?" And look, and everybody's here, I'm like, "Oh, I just got repossessed. Great."
[00:13:48] Mick Wilson: Mm-hmm.
[00:13:49] Bill Wilson: So I had to borrow more money from brother-in-law and, uh, bail it out. And, but yet, you know, we, we just had this resolve.
We just knew that we just had to get open. Once we got open, we knew things would be okay. And when we got open, things not only got okay, they got great. It actually was a, a problem. We had too many people.
And we've been known as the, you know, busy winery, and we're too busy, you don't wanna go there, and, you know, from the inception.
And we kept growing and growing and, and making more and accommodating more and building more to accommodate more. And, you know, we're busy because, you know, for a reason. You know, this is a fricking cool-ass property. You come in here and you sit around and you go, "Wow, I have no idea I'm in Southern California.
I have no idea that, you know, a, a mall is literally three miles away. I have no idea I can go watch state-of-the-art movies in reclining s- th- seats, you know, five minutes away." it's wonderful. So,
[00:14:57] Mick Wilson: I, I would you do... P- people always talk about the vibe at the winery where people aren't just coming 'cause we got a great courtyard, good wines, concerts, food, et cetera. That's all bonus. But I hear thousands of times, literally, there is some unspoken dynamic of vibe. I call it for some people like a pocket of sanity, where people come and they just feel welcome and loved on and, and accepted no matter who they are.
I mean, how would you put into words the vibe?
[00:15:26] Bill Wilson: The, the vibe is we enhance lives. That's our purpose statement. That's kinda a Rosie and Jerry, uh, when they met you, our parents, you know, they wanted to enhance your life with a little tidbit, a little, little positivity, a little something. So When you walk in here, y- your shoulders just drop. We, we are, um, as you said, a, an island of sanity amongst an ocean of frenzy.
[00:15:56] Mick Wilson: I like that
[00:15:57] Bill Wilson: and, and, uh, when you're here, you just, you just feel different, and everybody has that and shares that. from every single guest service that we have, um, they're out there trying to put a smile on people's face. A- and, and it's a purpose. It's, it's, it's by design, uh, which is, I, I don't want anybody else to, to listen to this and copy our by design, but,
you know, we're a hospitality f- you know, I, I kinda say quality wine, quality time, not necessarily in that order, in that, you know, quality time is as important as the quality wine.
You gotta have both
[00:16:38] Mick Wilson: I, I, I remember we had a, a, tri-union, a three union recently. Your class, which was '80, my class 1981, Libby, younger sister, 1982, and people who came to the winery, it was interesting to hear the comments. They're saying what we did at South Pasadena in not just the parties, but welcoming people, always a chair at the table, always people coming in, exchange students, runaways hanging out with us, living with us for years, and they said, "What you're doing in Temecula is on steroids on what you did in South Pasadena.
It's the same thing, just bigger." And I, I, and I hear that and I smile. What, what, what do you see as that overlap?
[00:17:19] Bill Wilson: more purposeful. It's more purposeful. Um, you know, we grew up just that was the way it was. That's what you did. Um, that's the way you operated. And, um, you know, that came again from Rosie and Jerry. So when we did this, it was just a natural thing for us to continue to do that, and it resonated, you know, with our wine club members that felt like extended family, and we call them extended family, and we treat them like extended family.
Um, and it, uh, it was by design, absolutely 100%, but it was b- by design of who we were. And, and, you know, we're God's children. You wanna get, you know, kinda a little bit of the divine side in there. It was just more we're, we're kinda Jesus-like, you know? Just, "Hi, welcome. Love on you." You know, you could have, you know, tattoos all over your face, instantly you killed three people, and I'm gonna say, "Hi, I love your shoes."
You know, and I'm gonna give you a little compliment or something. Now that everybody knows my secret, but, um, I wanna find the good in everybody that walks through that door, and I wanna hug on 'em, and I wanna appreciate 'em. And when we enhance somebody's life as, as I tell people, when you make somebody smile, guess what?
You smile. When you, when you, you know, treat them well and they feel it, and they reciprocate to it, guess what? You feel well.
[00:18:50] Mick Wilson: And, and to, and to tweak that divine element a little bit that, you know, the, the church should be the most inclusive, accepting of all backgrounds, of all ethnicities, where everyone's welcome at the table, uh, breaking barriers, d- uh, destroying dividing walls. What I've heard over and over from people at the w- visiting the winery is we are the most, I don't, I don't know if the word, uh, diverse, but the amount of people and different ethnicities and backgrounds that are there, it just...
That's cool. I don't think that's something we intentionally leaned into. I think maybe you can speak to that, is it is just as though everyone who walks in the door, we're gonna love on you
[00:19:28] Bill Wilson: Yeah, you know, e- everybody has red blood, right? I don't care the color of your skin. Um, and, and this is where I think, you know, specifically me in talking about the divine, um, you know, uh, to get religious for a second, you know, all the religions, they don't accept each other. They don't like each other.
They kinda look down on each other. "Ours is better than yours, yours is better than ours."
[00:19:57] Mick Wilson: the in and the out. Yep. Mm-hmm
[00:19:59] Bill Wilson: yeah, we don't do that here. We're like, "Hey, love on you. I don't care if you're green, yellow, red, blue. You know what? As long as you're cool, we love on you." You know, if you're a dick and you start treating our t- our staff like dicks, or start, you know, mistreating the other people around you, hey, we'll take, we'll take control and, and you're not gonna be welcome here.
[00:20:24] Mick Wilson: That's, that's good theology. Don't, don't be a dick.
[00:20:27] Bill Wilson: yeah, don't be a dick. Well, uh, you know, I, I, I've coached my kids, and they say, "What's dad's favorite saying?" It's like, "Don't be that girl. Don't be that girl." And, you know, don't be that girl that wanders off by herself. Don't be that girl that gets so drunk that somebody takes advantage of her. Don't be that girl that's just a little giggy gig. Don't be that girl. And everybody knows that girl. Don't be that. And, uh, so it's not just, you know, don't be that person that's just everybody looks at and goes, "What a douche."
[00:21:00] Mick Wilson: Now, now put on your, your CEO hat for a sec. What are some things that just get you up in the morning and you're just ex- so excited about? And at the same time, what are those things that, uh, give you nightmares about the business?
[00:21:15] Bill Wilson: Well, it's, it's been money woes from day one is what scares the shit out of me. Um, the lack of it, and that's where the one percenters that don't have the money, everybody else in the wine industry has made millions in the dotcom or real estate or attorneys or whatever. You know, we, we mortgaged our homes, we pooled our, our labor resources and, and we s- just did it.
We... As, as we say, we burned the boats in the bay a long time ago. We have no retreat. We have nothing else. This is all we have. And when it's all you have, you have no choice but to make it the number one and work your ass off to make sure that it, it succeeds. Now, add 200 and some employees to that, that they're relying on you to feed their families, and that's a huge burden.
That's a huge responsibility. So, you know, just that gets me going and, and... But again, I love what I do. Um, I'd do it for free, and some of our board of directors, um, yeah, made me do it for free for a while. And, uh, you know, it just is what it is.
[00:22:41] Mick Wilson: Well, well, well, I could tell you this. We wouldn't obviously be, be where we are without you, your entrepreneurial vision, you got awards for that, but you're the one down there making it happen, grinding away, uh, working on the numbers, especially COVID, post-COVID. Um, as you know, people drinking is going down a little bit, which affects us.
But, uh, uh, what causes you, not just financially, but to, to, to turn on your pillow and like, "Oh my, oh my God, what are we doing here?"
[00:23:13] Bill Wilson: Yeah, it's, i- you know what, what really freaks me out is all the employees and all their little bitching and the, you know, a little backstabbing and, you know, tit for tats, and I want this, I want that. And, and you know, the, the state of California that we live in allows them to, to do that.
[00:23:32] Mick Wilson: And that, that's just a few, few employees. Yeah, yeah.
[00:23:34] Bill Wilson: yeah.
But a few employees, you know, as they say, you know the rule as every 10 people, uh, 10 employees, three of them are trying to pull you one direction, three are trying to pull you the o- other direction, and there are four people in the middle that they're trying to, trying to get to be on their side. So you've got, you've got, you know, that cancer that can just destroy the culture, as you said, and you have to do the, the tough things, and I'm not very good at that.
And, and neither is anybody, that's last name is Wilson, so
[00:24:13] Mick Wilson: I mean, if, if there's someone that's not a fit, that doesn't fit our hospitality, it's hard to just say, "Hey, just not a fit." But overall, what would you say, uh, would people say about our staff in general other than those that, you know, the toxic ones that we are, you know, you deal
with?
[00:24:31] Bill Wilson: e- even some of the toxic ones are some of the most nice ones, you know? It's just, uh, from the consumer standpoint. Um, so we've always had the most hospitable staff around. Constantly is, you know, you've got the nicest staff, they're great, they care, they're passionate, and again, that's by design. Um, and we encourage that, and we hire for that.
We hire the twinkle in the eye. We will... I will hire somebody that's more fun to be around than the smartest guy in the room.
[00:25:11] Mick Wilson: And we'll give them the tools. Yeah. Mm-hmm
[00:25:13] Bill Wilson: that, that, you know, will just crank out spreadsheets all day, every day. I need somebody that's gonna put some life behind them and put some energy into it and, and have fun with it, 'cause I'm with these people all day long.
So it's, it is from the ground up, from our landscapers to our, you know, C-suites, um, everybody along the way is, is got that, what we've kind of referred to as a hospitality gene. You've gotta like people to be in this business.
[00:25:43] Mick Wilson: to have the it.
[00:25:44] Bill Wilson: Yeah. Yeah, and when you don't have it, it, it shows and it, it creates consternation.
It, it creates that cancer spo- so to speak. But yet we have so many people around here, they won't tolerate it. They'll push them away
[00:26:01] Mick Wilson: Yeah. I'm gonna hit you with a speed round real quick here. This will be fun. This is the first, first speed round ever for Wine and the Divine. I think I know the answer to this, uh, red, white, or sparkling wine? I know. fav- favorite grape varietal Ah, Petite Sirah, baby.
[00:26:20] Bill Wilson: Beats RI for
[00:26:22] Mick Wilson: I think we gotta plant more of that in Temecula Valley for those other wineries.
I, that could be our, that could be our grape. You've been saying that for a while. We've got Italian varietals in the valley, we've
got French
[00:26:30] Bill Wilson: we got so many, we got so many people that think their property is the best property out there, that they think their grape and their wine is the best wine out there, and they think their, you know, Sangiovese should be the grape or the Syrah or whatever they've leaned into. So, you know, a- and, and seriously, that's what makes Temecula great.
We grow a lot of really good varietals, and we grow them well
[00:26:55] Mick Wilson: And for people who haven't been to Temecula Valley in a couple, three years, you'll see the quality of wine has just escalated with the type of farming, with the wine making. So come and, I mean, check it out. Yeah. Um, other question, what, what region outside of Temecula do you like?
[00:27:13] Bill Wilson: Paso Robles
[00:27:15] Mick Wilson: Paso. Oh, their cabs are so good.
I love Paso. So good. And when... Do, do you like when you go up the 101, do you go east or west, or both?
[00:27:25] Bill Wilson: I go up the 5 and cut over the 46,
[00:27:28] Mick Wilson: route. So you, you hit those east wineries and
then
[00:27:31] Bill Wilson: just, well, I, you know, I just wanna get there quickly. I started going to Paso when we started water skiing at Lake Nacimiento, and we'd water ski in the morning, and we'd go wine tasting in the afternoon, then we'd go drunken tubing or boating at night. Um, and that, you know, we, you know, okay, you're the least amount of, of, you know, drunk person, you drive the boat.
So, you know, nowadays that would be very frowned upon, but that was 30 years ago, so
[00:28:02] Mick Wilson: Okay, favorite food and wine pairing
[00:28:06] Bill Wilson: Food and wine pairing. You know what? That is so delicate. Um, I've had so much great food and wine pairing, but there just is nothing better than a good steak and a good bold... I'm gonna stick with my petite Sirah, but a big red. You know, whether it's a cab, a big red, uh, the zin, uh, that can stand up to a steak, you know, versus a pinot that's not necessarily gonna stand up to a steak
[00:28:36] Mick Wilson: Yep. What would you say, uh, most underrated wine? Are you drinking it right now?
[00:28:43] Bill Wilson: No, no, no. I, I, I think, um, you know, one of our most underrated and underappreciated wine is the Mourvèdre.
[00:28:52] Mick Wilson: Yep
[00:28:53] Bill Wilson: It's been... You know, it's a blended wine, and we've made it into a varietal, and it's just finicky. It's very much like the Pinot, which is overrated. The, uh, the Mourvèdre one year will give you a light, another will give you a dark, and, you know, it drives the winemakers crazy.
But you get a good Mourvèdre, and people go, "What the hell is that? What Mou- What's a Mourvèdre?" Blah, blah, blah. They can't even pronounce it.
[00:29:24] Mick Wilson: then, yeah, yeah.
[00:29:25] Bill Wilson: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
[00:29:27] Mick Wilson: Um, so more of a, of a question on the divine. You could take this anywhere. What have you learned, you know, just a couple things from the vineyard, regenerative farming, people, guests, staff, family. Uh, what have you learned about God in just sunsets, the vines, the people, the family?
What are some things that go, "Oh God, God is good"?
[00:29:52] Bill Wilson: Yeah, it, you know, a little bit of everything in all of that. Um, it's not just one thing. It's the cumulative thing that makes, you know, you, you respect God and just go like, "My God, no one person, no one human, no one me could possibly create all this." I, I don't, I, I don't even know if there... God could create it.
I mean, it's beyond that. It's just like, oh my gosh. It's just amazing. When you look out at night and the stars and the crystal clear out here 'cause of the lack of, of lights, so to speak. Um, it's getting a little bit more lit now, but you know, you see the galaxies and you just go, "Wow." You see the sunset and you go, "Wow."
You see the sunrise, you go, "Wow." You see the grapes and, and their, their whole cycle of life and you go, "Wow." And you see the interaction between the grapes and, and the nature and, and everything else, and you go, "Wow." And then we as humans, all we try to do is kind of nudge and push Mother Nature along and just go, "Wow."
You know, our job is as humans, as winemakers, is not to screw up what Mother Nature intends. We try to maximize what nature is and, and the whole regenerative agriculture th- kick that we've been on for quite a few years, and we're on a bleeding edge, and I'm very excited about, takes that 100% into account.
And you know, you're not gonna be the most absolutely pristine mowed and manicured, 'cause that's not a healthy vineyard. We're f- ours is a wild, wild west out
[00:31:34] Mick Wilson: Yeah. Me- Messi is better.
[00:31:36] Bill Wilson: yeah, it's like that took us, that took me and you. I know we, we struggled with that for years 'cause we'd go out and take pictures. We'd come down and tell our winemaker, "What about this?"
And I mean, the vineyard manager, and they go, "No, that's not healthy." And I'm like, "Yeah, but that's what the consumer thinks, you know, wants to see."
[00:31:55] Mick Wilson: Yeah, and the whole backstory for those that don't know regen, regenerative agriculture, is more the merrier. You want a lot above the ground to feed the nutrients and the mycorrhizal network or the fungal network under the ground. And what Greg Pennyroyal, our vineyard manager, says is one handful of healthy soil... At one time I called it dirt, and he corrected me, "It's soil." One handful of healthy soil has seven billion microbes in it. You're like, "Really? Okay. That, that, that'll make some good wine," right?
[00:32:25] Bill Wilson: and, and, you know, the whole thing is the regenerative part of it is, you know, we have stripped out the nutrients from our soil over
[00:32:34] Mick Wilson: Oh yeah
[00:32:35] Bill Wilson: And so we're, we, we replace it with chemicals, and the chemicals are not binding. They're not forever. They're just, they, they get used, and they get abused, and then they go away, so you still have a unhealthy soil.
So, you know, with animals and everything and how nature's supposed to work with, you know, the herding animals out there that are foraging, and then you got the predators come through and push them onto another. They would've just stayed there and ripped up their thing if it wasn't for, you know, the wolves and the other predatory animals out there, and they push them into other areas, and we lack that.
And so now you see these major wildfires that they blame it on global warming. No, that's not... They're just not allowing the forest to be the forest, and they preserve it and protect it so much that they overprotect it. So anyway, let's not get political on that. But, you know, but it's God's way of, of making sure that everything's in balance,
and when we step in as humans and think we're holier than thou and God-like, and we do it this way, we upset that, that delicate balance in nature, and that's what we're dealing with now.
And, um, you know, stripping the, the rainforests and stripping all that, and we just have to start putting it back into balance
[00:34:03] Mick Wilson: Yep. And good soil absorbs carbon and stores it. Um, yeah.
[00:34:08] Bill Wilson: But it's not gonna be through electric vehicles. That's not what it's gonna be.
[00:34:12] Mick Wilson: it's through bringing back good soil, and that's gets carbon out of the atmosphere and yeah. Um, a- and for those listening, a couple good, good movies. One is called Kiss the Ground, narrated by Woody Harrelson. Another one called Common Ground, narrated by, by Aquaman, um, Jason Momoa. And then another one called The Biggest Little Farm, which is cool if you're interested in regen.
Um, so back on the family real quick is what would you say r- right now describe your, your grandpa. H- I, how has that affected your priorities and, and what, what, what has that meant to you?
[00:34:49] Bill Wilson: Well, let's go back to one of the first reasons why we even started this is, um, my own children. Uh, I moved out here when we had a three and a half and an 18-month-old. Um, and people would call me and say, "What are you doing?" I said, "I'm watching my baby sleep." They said, "No, no, no, really, what are you doing?" I said, "I'm watching my baby sleep."
[00:35:14] Mick Wilson: to that
[00:35:15] Bill Wilson: Because, I was leaving, you know, to go to the office at 5:30 in the morning, traveling an hour and a half, working eight to 10 hours a day, sometimes more, driving an hour and a half back, sometimes spending the night up in Pasadena, which was a treat that I didn't have to drive three hours. And I'm like, "This is no life."
I don't care how successful financially you are, which I wasn't, but it, it just wasn't who I was. And, and so it started there. It really did. It, that was what was the implement. A- and our kids knew exactly where I was. I was working, you know, 14, 16 hours a day, but they knew I was right there, and they came down and visited, and there's nothing better than getting a, you know, one of your little kids to grab you behind the counter as you're serving somebody a Cabernet, and, "Hi, Daddy."
And they'd mimic how we slurp wine, but they do it with milk and, you know, it, it's all about that, and it's all about the, the family. It just, it, it, to see my daughters grow of age, and, and specifically Cassidy, who's like, "Yes, I want to be part of this. I want to take this to the next level. This is what I want."
And then, you know, my other daughter says, "You know what? I, I just want to make the best pastries for the winery I can. I don't want to sell them to five different wineries. I want to be the best mom I can." Uh, But Brock, her husband, wants to be the tasting room manager, and he wants to run this thing. He wants to be the ops guy eventually, but, you know, they're chomping at the bit.
He's 30 years old. You know, he's got some maturity to do. But you know, the lure of Wilson Creek, you get a lot of these financial guys that says, "Oh, hey, if you ever wanna sell," I get them all day long, "Hey, the valuation of your company, you wanna sell," blah, blah, blah.
"What's your exit strategy?" And I used to say, "See that loving couple over there with the two dogs at their feet, and they're opening their mail? Yeah, they're sitting there watching their kids work their ass off to make sure that nothing they get is nothing but positive comments. That's my job. That's my job to do."
"What's your job description?" "Make sure they get nothing but positive comments so that they can live out their 80s and 90s
[00:37:41] Mick Wilson: Yeah. Rosie and Jerry. Yep.
[00:37:42] Bill Wilson: Yeah, right? And I go, "I want that." I wanna sit there, have wonderful lunch, uh, s- sometimes dinner I, I do, and I get to look and, and see the kids running around there working their little tail off, and I love that
[00:37:58] Mick Wilson: So, so what has that, what are you saying no to more and living more of like a focus with, let's say, and what would you say you're leaning into that brings you more joy?
[00:38:12] Bill Wilson: I'm saying no to more outside meetings. I'm on all these boards and all these committees that pay me nothing. And, you know, one of my goals back in the mid, you know, in the 2010 when I did get the awards and all that for Citizen of the Year was I wanted to put Temecula on the map. I wanna make sure that, you know, the wine country map didn't stop at Santa Barbara, that it kept going, and, uh, worked with some great groups of people to make that happen.
But from there you get some others, and then some others, and all of a sudden everybody will want something for you. So I, I'm guarding my time a little bit more. Um, I'm, I'm trying to get out of here a little bit more. I'm, I'm trying not to just, you know, live, breathe, and die Wilson Creek. You know, wherever I go, I am a poster board, and by all means, if you see me outside of here, please say hi.
I love it and I live for that, but I'm always be marketing. You know, I always will have Wilson Creek on something somewhere. Much to my wife hates it, but she gets it
[00:39:25] Mick Wilson: Oh my gosh, I'm, I'm at the pipe store today getting sprinkler fittings. I walk in the door and two guys go, "Hey, Bill." It's like, "I'm his brother." But you're, you're out there in the community
[00:39:37] Bill Wilson: Yeah, and, and you know, it's kinda funny, we look more and more alike as we get older. Uh, yeah, it's kinda crazy. It's like, you know, people would say, say, "Hey Mick, how you doing?" You know, da, da, da, da. "I saw you speak the other day." I'm like, "Yeah, no, that was my brother."
[00:39:53] Mick Wilson: Cadre
[00:39:54] Bill Wilson: So which is pretty cool that, you know, we have this, this mutual love for each other and mutual respect and, and I love what you're doing in the, you know, community out there and, and as you know, I've encouraged you to write this book, and I've encouraged you to do this because that gives you a platform
[00:40:12] Mick Wilson: Write this, how, how did you phrase it? Write the what book?
[00:40:16] Bill Wilson: Write your fucking book. Get it done, because that'll give you a platform that nobody else has.
[00:40:23] Mick Wilson: I'm at rough draft version right now, which is good. So it's in editor's hands, and I feel pretty good about that. Yeah.
This has been two million years. Yeah
[00:40:30] Bill Wilson: that'll free me up
[00:40:36] Mick Wilson: Mm-hmm.
[00:40:39] Bill Wilson: to write my book to then get me out on the speaker circuit as I continue to, uh, let my daughter and others run the company, and I just continue to guide it from, from above, so to speak
[00:40:53] Mick Wilson: So what would you want the, the, the Bill years ago, 20 years ago, we're opening or we're starting, what would you say to that Bill
[00:41:04] Bill Wilson: back then?
[00:41:06] Mick Wilson: Yeah, know- knowing what you know now, you would go back, what would you say? "Hey, hey self."
[00:41:12] Bill Wilson: That hey self, don't try to do it all yourself. You're killing yourself. Get other people in- involved, and if they don't, get, be a little bit of a, more of an asshole about it and, and get them involved.
So yeah, it, uh, it would be, you know, this self is to have others, but in an entrepreneurial position, you, you gotta run.
You don't have money to go pay somebody else to do something. You don't, you don't have that option. Uh, so you gotta do it all. But I did way too much. I tried, uh, a- and it got beyond me, and I probably fucked up more than I, you know, some of it. But, you know, through it all, again, nobody is gonna say that, that, uh, this was just handed to us.
You know? We, we worked our butt for it
[00:42:02] Mick Wilson: Well, back in the day, I mean, you're, you're running, you know, and but Jennifer is running the tasting room, Jerry's at the cash register doing tours, I'm doing landscaping, mowing, and then working on labels and doing tours. Deanna's involved in distribution. Craig and Libby, Libby's HR, Craig's out there.
It was everyone just all hands on deck. You were the, the captain, but, uh, people just look at this and go, "Wow, you guys are just sitting around," and you go, "Whoa, whoa, whoa. I wish you could go back and see what it took." But that's
[00:42:33] Bill Wilson: They go, "Guy, you're going on a lot of vacations." Yeah, because for 17 years I didn't go on one, you know? Or one to Lake Powell, and that was about it. But, uh, now, you know, they're like, you know, "Don't... You can't, coach on the weekends. You can only observe. Coach Monday through Friday." That was, uh, David Chavez.
Gotta tip my hat to him.
[00:42:55] Mick Wilson: Yeah, he was a consultant. Yeah.
[00:42:57] Bill Wilson: Yeah, can't coach in the whirlwind. You gotta coach when it's calm. And, you know, you gotta let your team make some decisions, and you can't be here because they'll, uh, they'll think differently. Did you know that there is a, um, a call sign when I walk on property?
[00:43:14] Mick Wilson: I've heard about that. Yeah. It's a, it's a little, it's a little thing the staff say amongst themselves that you're
on,
[00:43:20] Bill Wilson: they put it into the, into the radio, "Ca-caw, ca-caw." Uh, that means
[00:43:26] Mick Wilson: like officer on deck, but it's a code that the staff
[00:43:28] Bill Wilson: a code.
[00:43:29] Mick Wilson: around.
[00:43:30] Bill Wilson: And I'm like, "What?" I, I just found this out a couple weeks ago. I'm like, "That is bullshit."
But yet, hey, that's smart from them. Hey, get ... Hey, look busy, right?
[00:43:41] Mick Wilson: With our old vineyard crew, when you and I would walk on in the vines, there was a certain whistle that they would do like, like heads up, uh, you know, owner's here.
[00:43:50] Bill Wilson: Yeah
[00:43:51] Mick Wilson: d- a q- quick question here for, for those in a family business, what would you encourage them what you've learned? I mean, there's, there's pros and cons, but how would you encourage someone that's in that right now?
[00:44:03] Bill Wilson: highly, highly recommend it But you gotta put guardrails on it. Best thing you can do is hire a, a family business coach. that gives everybody... A- and he's almost a referee, so to speak, and mediator. He hears both sides. You can open up to him if they're good, and they go, "I kinda hear what you're saying, but, you know, the business."
You know, we used to operate that, you know, it was family first, and you were the one that did the rally cry of, you know, it's business first, and if we take care of the business, it'll take care of the family. And that's what you have to keep, keep, you know, at the forefront. We gotta take care of the business, and it'll take care of the family.
[00:44:50] Mick Wilson: Yep.
[00:44:51] Bill Wilson: And so you're really business first
[00:44:53] Mick Wilson: I love it. Bring in, bring in a consultant. If that consultant's not a fit, find another one. They're out there, but it's
worth
[00:44:59] Bill Wilson: we've had our, our, our, our generations of consultants that meet you where you're at, you know? And, uh, you know, our first consultants were other wineries down the road telling us what we should do and not do.
[00:45:13] Mick Wilson: Yeah, they were
[00:45:13] Bill Wilson: And then, yeah, then the family business consultant, then the financial business consultant, then the executive team business consultant, then the whole COVID crazy consultant, and then, you know, their bankers and everything else that, that they put the framework so we get, could get through COVID.
[00:45:30] Mick Wilson: And, for those in the family business, y- you know, it's, it's, it's tough. Our family, every person, uh, the, the kids, uh, we have big personalities, and you can... Your family can survive if you visit each other twice a year, but when you're working daily, uh, some of those sparks fly. So we don't have people that just are laying down and let people running over 'em.
It, it, it, there are some sparks, but we work through that, and I think that's what actually made us better
[00:45:57] Bill Wilson: Yeah, for sure. Um, 100%. Um, you know, you, I,
I always said, and I still say to this day, I'm like that thoroughbred racehorse that just wants to go, and you're that jockey that, that,
[00:46:11] Mick Wilson: It's like, whoa,
[00:46:12] Bill Wilson: hold,
hang on, hang on, hang on. You're that jockey that holds on, holds on, and then all of a sudden says, "Go, go, go, go!" I'm like,
"What? Well, shit."
[00:46:22] Mick Wilson: Mm-hmm. Yep.
[00:46:23] Bill Wilson: And,
[00:46:24] Mick Wilson: I like that analogy. That's
[00:46:25] Bill Wilson: yeah, it, it's a really, really good analogy 'cause I just wanna run and go, and you're like, "Well, let's put some framework around it.
Let's get some ROI to it, and that is good. And then, and then, well, why haven't you done it yet? Let's go. We talked about it. Let's go." And I'm like, "Well, wait, wait a
[00:46:41] Mick Wilson: but without horse there's no go, right? Yeah.
[00:46:44] Bill Wilson: Correct. I mean, you can just sit here and live off your laurels, but you're gonna die. You know, if you're not growing, you're dying.
If you're not re- reinventing yourself, you're not... You know, my current, um, chairman of the board and, and CEO mentor is, is agility. You got, you gotta change with the time. What worked six months ago is not gonna work today.
What worked 10 years ago is not gonna work today. And, you know, he's all about this whole AI thing.
I mean, we didn't have this podcast ability five years ago, 10 years ago really, uh, without spending extreme amounts of money. So, you know, it's ti- of the times, and you gotta change with it
[00:47:24] Mick Wilson: Um, last question for you is what do you want down the road? Maybe last question. Down the road, let's say 25
[00:47:32] Bill Wilson: we could do this for hours and hours probably
[00:47:36] Mick Wilson: like the wine, but it's usually
[00:47:37] Bill Wilson: should just do it just for the family videos for heaven's sake, you
[00:47:41] Mick Wilson: do, we're gonna do part two for sure. What would you want 25 years from now? We're, 25th anniversary, we're, we're looking 25 years for just the family, the dynamic, maybe the impact that we've left or are leaving.
What do you hope would be the takeaway?
[00:48:00] Bill Wilson: Yeah, I, I think about that a lot, what's your legacy? And, you know, Jerry and Rosie have left a legacy for us to cultivate, and I always say, "I wanna be Jerry 2.0."
[00:48:16] Mick Wilson: Right?
[00:48:17] Bill Wilson: And y- you know, for those that don't know Jerry, I feel sad for them, and a lot of our executive team, a lot of our management team has never met Jerry. And if you've met him, you'll know what I'm talking about, is I wanna be Jerry 2.0. I don't wanna be J- he, he's an amazing man, and I don't know if I'll live up to it, but at least trying to be more Jerry-like, uh, and, and more Jesus-like type of a, a person, is, you know, is something. And then 25 years from now, if we, we look back and just go, "Wow, wow." You know? Y- you know, 50 years and, and, and who knows what the next 25's gonna bring. I, I know I at one point wanted to own wineries across the United States and up and down, and one incident in my life changed that thought process to I just wanna have the best winery possible and work with the friends and family and the best people I can and appreciate and enjoy life the best I can because it might get taken away from you.
It's like that, health or otherwise. You know the deal. So yeah, I h- A, I hope I'm around in 25 years to see it because I'll be 89 and a half. Jerry passed away at 90 and a half, so I think I can get
[00:49:50] Mick Wilson: Yeah, we're gonna do
[00:49:51] Bill Wilson: and, and you know, one of Jerry's s- sayings, and I repeat this often, is, "Life is not like a box of chocolates.
It's more like a roll of toilet paper." Because the first part of the year it took forever for Christmas to come around, and as you got older it'd get faster and faster and faster and faster and faster. And, he's like, you're my age, you know, it's, the closer you are to the end, every sheet matters."
A- and COVID hit home on that one. Everybody was like, "Oh, we got... Uh-oh." And every sheet matters.
[00:50:27] Mick Wilson: Oh, that's a name for a, article or a book. Every sheet matters
[00:50:31] Bill Wilson: Every she matters, cause... Yeah, every she matters. So yeah, I, you know, I, I hope I will, uh, you know, will touch people's lives in such a way that, that they'll remember me forever, 'cause that's what they did with Jerry.
Um,
[00:50:32] Mick Wilson: versus I don't give I don't give a sheet is another, you know, um, yeah
[00:50:36] Bill Wilson: yeah, every sheet matters, so, Yeah, you know, I, I hope I will
touch people's lives in such a way that that they'll remember forever cause that's what they did with Gerry. uh, i don't
I don't wanna leave a, a building. A building isn't it. It's the culture. It's
the,
[00:50:57] Mick Wilson: the,
people.
[00:50:58] Bill Wilson: the, it's the people and, and, and how you touch those people and how you enhance those people's lives and created opportunities for them. Uh, you know, whether it's temporary or whether it's a lifelong journey, uh, through wine.
You know, come aboard. Let's go
[00:51:17] Mick Wilson: Well said. Hey, cheers bro.
[00:51:19] Bill Wilson: Yeah, back at you, brother.
All right, man. Hey, love ya. Thanks for,
[00:51:23] Mick Wilson: thanks for sharing. Cheers.
